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PilotWings1

Surrgoates outside the U.S.

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PilotWings1    0

Hi!

What is the best country outside the U.S. to find a surrogate, for IP's in the U.S. that can't afford what U.S. based companies charge?

Plus I'd like to reciprocate in helping someone from a less fortunate country.

I don't mind traveling.

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traci72    200

Go to Canada. That's the only other suggestion you will get that doesn't exploit and take advantage of these "less fortunate" women, as well as breaking the law or putting any potential baby at great risk, which is a pretty shitty thing for someone to want to do. Is surrogacy expensive? Unfortunately yes. Is using an agency required? No, but that only saves you $5-30K in the long run. 

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PilotWings1    0

I meant country was less fortunate, not the women, sorry for the confusion.

If someone in Central or South America is able to make 5+ years salary, for the same thing a surrogate in the US would only get 1 year's salary for, and could save the IP's 50% or more, that would be mutually beneficial rather than exploiting them, at least from my point of view.

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traci72    200

There was no confusion. I knew exactly what you meant. However, those women are still financially vulnerable and yes, it is not only taking advantage of them and exploiting them, but in many cases they have to leave their homes and communities to be a surrogate, and have to hide it, or at the very least, not talk about it. Those women can be ostracized and run out of their communities/villages. There are ZERO....and in case you didn't catch that...ZERO "0" protections for the IP's. Thailand, Nepal, Mexico, even the Ukraine, those women can refuse to hand that baby over, and THEY are legally protected. You are your child's 1st advocate, ever. How can one justify that they were willing to put their child's health, legal standing and even their life at risk (and yes, feel free to do a search here and you'll read the heartbreaking story of a woman whose newborn son DIED in another country. They cremated him, blackmailed her for his ashes, and they weren't even all his ashes! They gave her WOOD ashes!!), just to save a few bucks? And if you actually do any indepth research, you'll see that you will NEVER leave another country w/your child for the "little" amt you get quoted. You'll be paying bribes and blackmail to the clinics/Dr's, to the local law enforcement, etc. 

I can even tell you the story of IP's that went to another country for surrogacy, weren't allowed to really know what was going on, was told when their baby was born and then flew out. They "met" the woman that carried their baby, but she was NOT ALLOWED to communicate w/them. They found out that the money they paid for her housing (the surrogates are forced to live in dormatories and dictated to when they sleep, wake up, what they eat, what activities they are allowed to do, etc. Much like a jail) was taken a 2nd time out of her comp she was supposed to get! It was an accident that they found out, but it cut significantly into what the woman should have gotten. Because of this experience, they came to the US to pursue surrogacy in a more ethical and safe environment as well as one that offered the parents legal protections. (their 1st child is preschool age and they still do NOT have actual "legal" custody....they are forced to adopt their child and they are STILL waiting on the courts there to do it)

 

If you truly think that this is a "mutually beneficial" arrangement, then all I can say nicely, is that you need to do a ton more research as well as soul searching for something ethical. 

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PilotWings1    0

That's one side, how ever I consider the surrogate agencies in the US that want you to have $120k-$180k to even talk to them, taking advantage of vulnerable/desperate IPs.  Same goes for the insurance companies that will deny any kind of fertility or surrogacy as 'elective' items yet fully cover in-patient drug treatment for junkies.  And the same rules would apply in the US, ie a strongly Christian family not approving of their daughter becoming a surrogate in the US for financial reasons.

From my research I see Ukraine has protections for IPs.  An countries like Colombia have no current law prohibiting surrogacy.  As far as the health of the baby, the WHO ranks Colombia 22 in the world, the US is only ranked 37.  Trust me, we have our share of incompetent doctors here that have caused grave injury and death to newborns through gross negligence.

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traci72    200

I can count on one hand, literally, the number of agencies that demand this much up front. The vast majority of them do NOT have that requirement and have significantly lower agency fees, and again, one does NOT HAVE TO GO THROUGH AN AGENCY. You are very clearly arguing to try and justify wanting to use more questionable places to do surrogacy, and I can tell you, intentionally going to those countries is not supported or encouraged here. Your research is also lacking if you truly think you will have legal protection in the Ukraine or other countries, so good luck w/that. You seem to have your mind made up, so there is nothing more to try and explain to you or help you understand. 

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PilotWings1    0

I have not made up my mind, and actually would prefer a surrogate in North America if I can find a way.  

You say the benefit is that your US state will have protections for the IPs, but there have been cases in the US where the surrogate moved to a different state which lets her keep the child, and not make her return any fees (Michigan among several other states).

You mentioned Canada, but that seems out of the question as you can't pay a surrogate in Canada, so unless I want to go up to random women on the streets in Vancouver asking if they want to have my baby for free, I don't have many options there.

What its coming down to is come up with another $80-$120k (perhaps $5k or so less if I bypass an agency), after these fertility clinics have already milked you for $100k with no results, by getting a 2nd mortgage on my house, clearing out my retirement accounts (and taking a huge tax penalty by doing so), selling anything I have of value, and not still getting any guarantees.  Or paying $35-45k to an international agency, and being able to retire before I'm 85....

 

 

 

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traci72    200

Again, you show yourself to have done very little research and it seems you're happy to cherry pick the stories that don't even remotely represent surrogacy and are not paying attention to WHY these excuses for surrogates moved. The 2 cases that you've chosen to "highlight" are very specific to them choosing to break their contract because of things they agreed to (giving the parents the right to make the choice on to terminate or not, due to specific reasons) in their contracts, and then decided they didn't feel like doing. If you're actually doing your research, you'll see that this is NOT common at all, and those surrogates also, having breeched their contracts, had financial liabilities they were responsible for. 

 

You also clearly show your lacking of research in regards to Canadian surrogacy and how it works. I will again, very strongly, suggest that you do some ACTUAL research....READ THESE FORUMS, READ in FB groups, actually use Google for good research and not just stories to try and argue with, and talk to people that have done it and KNOW what they are talking about. Surrogacy is huge in Canada, and trust me, those women ARE getting getting compensated. They call it "reimbursement", however, it adds up to the equivalent of what many US surrogates get. Hell, I know Canadian surrogates whose reimbursements were well above anything I've gotten in comp here in the US.

 

And if you are ignorant, again, enough to believe that you'll get out of an international surrogacy for a paltry "$35-45K", you, sir, are delusional. 

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